Amy Sillman and Pam Lins, Fells, 2013–14

Narrator: Pam Lins is a sculptor, and Amy Sillman a painter. Here, they’ve collaborated to make a work that draws on both media. The piece grew out of a feeling Lins had that it was very difficult to make a sculpture that integrated painting in a complex, visually satisfying way.

Pam Lins: I'd been having that conversation with Amy. 

Narrator: Pam Lins.

Pam Lins: She was like, "Well, maybe if you used like somebody who was just involved with painting, you know, it would just sort of happen within the work," and so she gave me one of her paintings, and you know, shoved one in the back of my car, and I drove off to my studio and I started a sculpture.

Amy Sillman: I think we were engaged in mutual form of improvisation, which is really probably how jazz musicians work, or something. 

Narrator: Amy Sillman.

Amy Sillman: We had a structure, but we were free forming inside that. So we didn't know what we were doing, and we didn't really understand what they were.